Jeroen Diepemaat and Jacco Borggreve discuss the role of arts and culture in innovation and the responsibility of both individual makers and the government to support and promote it. They emphasize the importance of ecosystem and incubators to facilitate the connection and collaboration between artists and other professionals. The speakers also discuss the importance of creating affordable living spaces for young people and artists in a city where they can experiment and have room to grow, and the need to bridge the gap between the amateur and top sectors. Diepemaat promises to ensure that there will be a next place for the underground scene in their city.